Pets & their skills

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Pets & their skills

Post by Xcolibri » Wed Jan 29, 2003 5:56 pm

Okay, I made a new topic for that, this issue is big enough.

Some revision about equipment: Better have their lvl cap at 5 instead of 10 (not their level req, but their level of skill like I explained in the main thread). By lowering it to 5, it is less pain to switch to a better pet item, which is not leveled yet. Also five levels are enough since you can do so with all slots.
All pet items start at level 0.
All pet items spawn with +skill(s), %chance to cast xyz on struck/attack/hit.
I haven't thought about the items' look or name, just about their abilities.

I use MS for Morph Skill to name the special skill one get as a quest reward each act.

The skills depend on equipment, so theoretically you can have the level 5 skills in act 1. However, the level 5 skills are aimed at the final morph form.

* Act 1-6-11 : Birds of Prey
Eagle - Condor - Phoenix

Slot 1: Head
- level 1: +1 to all pet skills
...
- level 5: +5 to all pet skills
Also, at each new level, a low + all attributes

Slot 2: Weapon
- level 1: increased attack speed
- level 2: adds ac
- level 3: greatly increased attack speed
- level 4: attack blinds enemies (pick out eyes)
- level 5: adds area of effect fire damage and fire under the enemy

Slot 3: Armour
- level 1: fast hit recovery
- level 2: aura: fast run
- level 3: fastest hit recovery / a ot regeneration
- level 4: resist all + 50 %
- level 5: aura: avoid, dodge

The level 5 aura replaces the level 2 aura except in town.

MS act 1: ignore targets defense
MS act 2: physical resist 20%
MS act 3: absorb 100% fire

____________________________


* Act 2-7-12 : Predator
Wolf - Lynx - Shadow Panther.

Slot 1: Head
- see above

Slot 2: Weapon
- add big ac bonus
- 100% open wounds & slightly more damage
- %critical hit
- life leech & more damage
- fury

Slot 3: Armour
- physical resist 10%
- vitality bonus
- strength bonus
- fastest hit recovery & total physical resist 25%
- howls when pet or character drop below 5% health

MS act 1: frenzy
MS act 2: rabies
MS act 3: absorb magic (not elemental!) 35%
____________________________

* Act 3-8-13 : Golems
Rock Golem -> Iron Golem -> Adamantite Golem.

Slot 1: Head
- see above

Slot 2: Weapon
(all its weapons are very slow)
- adds ac
- low %crushing blow
- knockback
- long stun
- 75 %crushing blow

Slot 3: Armour (acts as shield, can block)
- defense bonus
- vitality + regeneration
- physical resist 20%
- strength & defense bonus
- aura: defiance and low bonus vitality & strength

MS act 1: chance to block + 15%
MS act 2: thorns
MS act 3: earthquake

I'd say remove the fourth slot for making equal & fair equipment for all pets.

*enters hint mode* pet sets, uniques and runewords would be extraordinary cool!

I haven't really thought about the left two pets. I still would like one ranged attack pet, without having a proper idea :(
One ethereal pet is great, but the lizward -> dragon idea is fine, too.

So I better don't start with skill design when we don't know the pets yet...
Last edited by Xcolibri on Wed Jan 29, 2003 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Wed Jan 29, 2003 9:11 pm

:D :D check your PM :D :D
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote:Okay, I made a new topic for that, this issue is big enough.
Nice idea :)
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: Some revision about equipment: Better have their lvl cap at 5 instead of 10 (not their level req, but their level of skill like I explained in the main thread). By lowering it to 5, it is less pain to switch to a better pet item, which is not leveled yet. Also five levels are enough since you can do so with all slots.
All pet items start at level 0.
All pet items spawn with +skill(s), %chance to cast xyz on struck/attack/hit.
I haven't thought about the items' look or name, just about their abilities.

I use MS for Morph Skill to name the special skill one get as a quest reward each act.
Ok seems correct but what is the max level for a pet ? 5 ?
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: The skills depend on equipment, so theoretically you can have the level 5 skills in act 1. However, the level 5 skills are aimed at the final morph form.
OK seems good IMHO
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: * Act 1-6-11 : Birds of Prey
Eagle - Condor - Phoenix

Slot 1: Head
- level 1: +1 to all pet skills
...
- level 5: +5 to all pet skills
Also, at each new level, a low + all attributes

Slot 2: Weapon
- level 1: increased attack speed
- level 2: adds ac
- level 3: greatly increased attack speed
- level 4: attack blinds enemies (pick out eyes)
- level 5: adds area of effect fire damage and fire under the enemy

Slot 3: Armour
- level 1: fast hit recovery
- level 2: aura: fast run
- level 3: fastest hit recovery / a ot regeneration
- level 4: resist all + 50 %
- level 5: aura: avoid, dodge

The level 5 aura replaces the level 2 aura except in town.

MS act 1: ignore targets defense
MS act 2: physical resist 20%
MS act 3: absorb 100% fire
very nice :)
I'm just a bit reluctant to use ITD so soon ...
but well why not ?
(not that ITD only appears on lvl50+ players unik)
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: * Act 2-7-12 : Predator
Wolf - Lynx - Shadow Panther.

Slot 1: Head
- see above

Slot 2: Weapon
- add big ac bonus
- 100% open wounds & slightly more damage
- %critical hit
- life leech & more damage
- fury

Slot 3: Armour
- physical resist 10%
- vitality bonus
- strength bonus
- fastest hit recovery & total physical resist 25%
- howls when pet or character drop below 5% health

MS act 1: frenzy
MS act 2: rabies
MS act 3: absorb magic (not elemental!) 35%
Nice, nothing to add except that the Lynx may end up into a jaguar.
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: * Act 3-8-13 : Golems
Rock Golem -> Iron Golem -> Adamantite Golem.

Slot 1: Head
- see above

Slot 2: Weapon
(all its weapons are very slow)
- adds ac
- low %crushing blow
- knockback
- long stun
- 75 %crushing blow

Slot 3: Armour (acts as shield, can block)
- defense bonus
- vitality + regeneration
- physical resist 20%
- strength & defense bonus
- aura: defiance and low bonus vitality & strength

MS act 1: chance to block + 15%
MS act 2: thorns
MS act 3: earthquake
Ok also, but maybe with a change of names here or there (iron & adamtine seems to close in my mind)
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: I'd say remove the fourth slot for making equal & fair equipment for all pets.
That's Ok and really easy
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: *enters hint mode* pet sets, uniques and runewords would be extraordinary cool!
Obviously !!
And I suppose that the [Amazon only] will end in [Pets Only]
All this items having 1/1 dur and are unrepairable.
Xcolibri";p="62129" wrote: I haven't really thought about the left two pets. I still would like one ranged attack pet, without having a proper idea :(
One ethereal pet is great, but the lizward -> dragon idea is fine, too.

So I better don't start with skill design when we don't know the pets yet...
yes the ranged one is a must have.
We can go with

* Lizard - Wyvern - Dragon
* Spider races but how to find THREE differents spidr names ...
* Faeries like ? with magic missile ?
* Ghost like ? with spectral hit ?
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:45 pm

hmmm did the Morph Skills only happens at Difficulty changes ??
So MS1 at normal
MS2 at nightmare
MS3 on Hell ???
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Jan 30, 2003 4:06 pm

I've got one question... is the blinding attack for pets possible? As far as I remember merc couldnt use things like blinding enemies...


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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Jan 30, 2003 4:10 pm

well, ... they're two possibilities:

- using the assassin skill that blind ...
- using a %chance to blind target item and it should work , I'll test it
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Xcolibri » Thu Jan 30, 2003 4:26 pm

hmmm did the Morph Skills only happens at Difficulty changes ??
The Morph Skills, how I called them, are thought as quest rewards from the former Blood Raven Quest (or any other...). Basically, you will get one MS-item, cube it with a pet item, and the skill will be granted to the pet. The downside is, that you can only do this once, by switching items you loose that MS. Since there are three difficulties -> three quest which give the item -> three skills.
what is the max level for a pet ? 5 ?
No, this should be like in D2:LoD, the pet can achieve the character's level -> 100.
I'm just a bit reluctant to use ITD so soon ...
The bird pet won't do much damage, so it's fair that it at least hit frequently.
Ok also, but maybe with a change of names here or there (iron & adamtine seems to close in my mind)
I have nothing at all against name or even golem changes, I think you suggested the name yourself, did you?

For the choice of the pets: Not only the graphic is important, also the idea behind the pet matters (aka it's skills, how it behave,...). Let me show you:

Eagle: Low life but quick. Low physical damage, later moderate fire damage with are of effect. It's still a support pet and not a damage dealer. Granting the avoid and / or dodge aura gives a serious boost to the character's defense. Also blinding the enemies is a good support as well.

Wolf: Moderate life, rather quick. Very good physical damage, but almost no supporting skills for the character like auras.

Golem: High life, high defense, slowest pet. Moderate damage but with crushing blow, so potential great damage. Very slow attack speed in return. The golem is not an offensive pet, it's a tank. Great for mages & range attacked characters.

What misses now?

Range attacker:Moderate life, quick. Moderate damage (physical or elemental), maybe spells. Area of effect attack preferred. One aura, too.

Magic user :I don't even talk of spells only. The ranged attacker will use spells, too. I'm talking of curses. So:
Low - moderate life, very quick. Maybe in ethereal form. Curses and some spells only, no physical damage. Area of effect & aura are nice here, too. Maybe healing.

Also, we have 30:5 = 6 skill slots for each pet.
Now we've used 4 (eagle) + 4 (wolf) + 4 (golem) = 12, 18 remain for the last 2 pet. If we take a spellcaster, it could easily use 10 skills. (Like 4 attack skills, 2 defensive, 1 aura, 3 MS). 8 for a ranged attacker is too much.
So I re-thought about our first three pet's skills and will edit them later.

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Jan 30, 2003 9:50 pm

I don't know about assassin blinding skill but as far as I know blinding from items doesn't work on mercs...


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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Jan 30, 2003 10:02 pm

Well, I'll test that !
If the Blind target mod doesn't work, i'll go into some dll editing I think :)
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Jan 30, 2003 10:29 pm

If I'm not mistaken other "sepcial add-ons" like crushing blow, open wounds etx... also have no effect if it's the merc who is using them..


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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Jan 30, 2003 10:42 pm

strange .. I once give to my merc a %crushing blow item and it seems it does more dmg ...
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Jan 30, 2003 10:45 pm

My merc has also crushing blow... it's true he had only 60% for it, but... seems I must have had bad luck...


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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Xcolibri » Fri Jan 31, 2003 12:37 am

Okay, I looked again at the pet skills and made some adjustments:

* Act 1-6-11 : Birds of Prey
Eagle - Condor - Phoenix

Slot 2: Weapon
- level 1: adds ac
- level 2: ignores target's defense
- level 3: greatly increased attack speed
- level 4: attack blinds enemies (pick out eyes)
- level 5: adds area of effect fire damage and fire under the enemy

Slot 3: Armour
- level 1: dexterity bonus
- level 2: aura: fast run / fast hit recovery *
- level 3: resist all + 50 %
- level 4: redemption (former Paladin skill, now castable)
- level 5: aura: avoid and +3 to fire skills

MS skills like before

* skills like in the main thread: Way of the Swallow
Now the eagle pet is improved and good. I felt like it improving it, since it has low life, is neither good in melee nor in range (damage-wise). The improved aura and redemption (the only healing skill so far for pets, nice for the phoenix holy power; great for corpse removal) now make up for it, I think.
__________________________
* Act 3-8-13 : Golems
Rock Golem -> Iron Golem -> Adamantite Golem.

Slot 2: Weapon
(all its weapons are very slow)
- damage bonus
- knockback
- long stun
- 50 %crushing blow
- battle cry (the one which decreases enemies' defense and damage)

Slot 3: Armour (acts as shield, can block)
- defense bonus
- resist all 15%
- physical resist 25%
- vitality & regeneration bonus
- aura: defiance and low strength bonus

MS skills remain, too.

I added the battle cry and changed some other stuff. Important is that the golem tank can only attack one enemy at a time and do so very slowly. In exchange he has good life and defense to hold itself against foes. Also great for aura sharing.
_____________________

The wolf pet was okay how it was, I think.
For the blinding issue. Assuming that blinding on attack doesn't work: You could let the eagle cast a spell with blinding effect, I think. Cursing for mercs does work. Maybe it would be even better, because blinding is more effective if the bird is not next to the enemy, otherwise the enemy would just attack the eagle anyway.
So taking the curse from the necromancer or that skill from the assassin should be okay. If you take the latter, be aware that the general 'light-down' effect is disliked in multiplayer.

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Aedeon » Fri Jan 31, 2003 4:54 am

just an idea, cause it would look really cool, if the bird minion was able to summon ravens like the druid spell, so you had a little flock of critters flying around taking people out for you

you could probably have it set up so that the spirits are ranged attackers and the elementals are magi, depends on the animation you have for them

you could have the golems go rock/iron/dimond or cryrstal, not sure what you would use as an animation for it though
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Fri Jan 31, 2003 11:42 am

Crystal golems... in IWD2 there were ice golems and they looked pretty well.

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Fri Jan 31, 2003 2:22 pm

Just checked : ITD, blind and other stuff works on Mercs, there is no counter effect ...

Now justa question that I think I already know the answer : could a merc use spell charge from items ?
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Fri Jan 31, 2003 2:51 pm

I'm not a modder, so I don't know what the rules about mercs are...
but if I had to answer that, I'd say no, but this could be a tricky question...
never thought about it before

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Xcolibri » Fri Jan 31, 2003 6:15 pm

I'm afraid the answer is no, although I don't know it for 100%. Guess, that it would need an AI change to let them use the charges. Tricky...

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Fri Jan 31, 2003 6:21 pm

Too bad :(

ok, tomorrow I'll show you the gfx I chosen for the various pets and some that may fit for the 2 remaining slots.
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Feb 06, 2003 4:46 pm

Post removed cause gfx links was defunct
Last edited by Joel on Wed Mar 31, 2004 9:21 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Feb 06, 2003 5:05 pm

Everything is all right, but... please could you change this giant chicken into sth else? graphics from homm4 is cool, but it makes me laugh everytime I look at the phoenix... I know that phoenix doesn't exist often, but maybe you'd find sth else... I'm sorry but I cant stand it...

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Feb 06, 2003 5:11 pm

well ... after a few seconds .. it's true it look like chicken :D
well, it's just a proposition ;)
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Aedeon » Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:33 pm

I'm gonna have to agree with that fried chicken statement it just doesn't look quite right, the griphon looks good, I like the smaller size

The preditors all look good, specialy the tiger

the golems look pretty cool, the iron golem is huge, if you can use the adamantium golem from BG2 it looks much different and can probably be as large or larger, plus it looks really cool

are the griphon and the phoenix going to be flying or walking around? or both like the vultures in act 2?
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:35 pm

My pesonally favorite one is rock golem :)

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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Joel » Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:37 pm

Aedeon";p="64755" wrote:I'm gonna have to agree with that fried chicken statement it just doesn't look quite right, the griphon looks good, I like the smaller size
well well, maybe it's the frame and the angle ?
For the griffin, it seems ppl like the small one so, go for the small one !
Aedeon";p="64755" wrote:The preditors all look good, specialy the tiger
isn't it :) It's for HooM4
Aedeon";p="64755" wrote:the golems look pretty cool, the iron golem is huge, if you can use the adamantium golem from BG2 it looks much different and can probably be as large or larger, plus it looks really cool
That what i tought. It's about the same size ...
Aedeon";p="64755" wrote:are the griphon and the phoenix going to be flying or walking around? or both like the vultures in act 2?
They'll fly a bit when walking and land for attacking & neutral.

I'll try to find some fx for the spirit/lizard pets for tomorrow ...
comemtns & ideas are still welcome !
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Re: Pets & their skills

Post by Mathiu Silverburg » Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:51 pm

What a pity that ragnarok online is paid now - it could be a nice source for few monsters :( ( especially few funny ones )

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