Situational weapons?

[Frain Breeze]

I'm tired of the "Weapon 1 = killamajig, Weapon 2 = prebuff stick" setup in vanilla gameplay, and I'd much rather see the second weapon slot be used for... well, another weapon. As such, I'm trying to think of ways the weapons can be made to work for different characters, playstyles, and even individual situations. Making them just feel different from one another would be acceptable as well.


Axes: ?

Daggers: For the close range required, I think these oughta have some bite to them. These should be suited to agile fighters rather than just the poison-casting geezer. Any ideas how, though?

Katars: See daggers. I sort of want to remove katars completely, since class-specific items make a lot of item drops "wasted" in single player.

Maces: I want these to give the impression that you're really knocking enemies around. A tiny amount of target-slow on the smaller ones, but huge damage and maybe knockback on the two-handers.

Polearms: ?

Scepters: These are probably going to be lumped in with maces.

Spears: ?

Staves: Agile, but defense-oriented fighters should use these. What would best help that along?

Swords: ?

Wands: I'm honestly just thinking of removing these. Charging into battle with a wand just sounds silly.



Bows: The default choice for ranged focus. Not much else to be said here.

Crossbows: These will be a ranged attack choice you don't have to build around. They will have low stat requirements and good damage, but they do not gain bonuses from dexterity. Anyone who needs a reliable ranged attack can get it with a crossbow, but a focused bow user will always be better.

Javelins: Strong ranged damage, but only so-so in melee. Perhaps they could have knockback so the enemies stay at range?

Throwing Axes: Good both at range and up close. Let the barbarian open up with Double Throw, then go into Frenzy without missing a beat.

Throwing Knives: These are what I picture for applying status effects at range. Melee damage is a little better than ranged.

Throwing Potions: I want these to be sort of like the grenades of a FPS game. They're the go-to weapon for large crowds or tough monsters, but you can't carry or find enough to use them all the time.




On a side note, how do I go about removing items that I don't see any point in keeping around?

[azianX]

Perhaps polearms and spears could have more maneuverability granting them some sort of armor piercing effects, or more just piercing weapons instead have that effect (such as daggers/spears/javelins) where bladed weapons could cause bleeds...

In vanilla I had made a char that did make use of the weapon swap but it was only to a limited degree, everyone pre 1.10 did have the hybrid zon that had the bow + jav/shield, I had made a hybrid paladin in 1.10 that had zeal for close combat and I used widowmaker for range... There are a few issues that come into play with the weapon swaps in that its not a fast system (you can't go bam bam bam swap whack whack, you have to stop before you can swap, sounds insiginificant but when it does play a role its huge)

To really get players into using a swap and not just for pre-buffs, you'd want to encourage the use of a secondary weapon, IE ranged skills as well as melee specific skills, and to limit the effectiveness of spells that are just ranged on their own.

I can't say that I'd remove wands, but instead could make them more for powerful spells so a user can still use a shield.

[Phlogistos]

Good idea, even though in vanilla LoD I do try to use the second slot exactly like you proposed.

Anyway, some ideas for you:

Dagger: Melee weapon for ranged fighters, if monsters come too close. Take a look at for example LotR: Legolas draws knives in close combat. Or archers in Civilization (IV) - they initially defend with bows and then finish attackers off with daggers. So they could perhaps have very short range but built-in deadly strike/ crushing blow or something but need hight dexterity (thus trying to simulate that a knife placed in the right place can be more deadly than a sword slash to the leg, for example, but you need high dex to hit those spots); could perhaps grant the skill "stab" for additional damage.

Axes: High damage, but not so much chance to hit (since you can't stab with an axe, or use it very well in an upswing, but coming from the sides and especially above they can be devastating - alternatively a small mindam and high maxdam) and no good for parrying. Perhaps open wounds on them, small chance of crushing blow / deadly strike. Quite high strength req, but low dex.; could grant a skill "cleave" or something that attempts to split the opponent's skull → adds insane amount of damage but leaves you open to being attacked.

Maces: Crushing blow, + damage to undead (seems to be a given in any RPG and has some inherent logic). Damage very dependent on strength, but strength not necessarily a requirement to wield them. Dunno if it is possible to make it so that more strength increases attack speed. Could grant a skill "maim" with additional damage to undead + slow/ stun target

Polearms: good melee range, rather high dex req, medium strength; damage increased with dex and perhaps strength (more dex - hit in better places, strength - hit harder, especially because lever action from the handle). Could grand a skill "sweep" or "mow down" (especially on scythes) to attack multiple enemies in one go or (mow down), slow them/ stun them.

Scepters: They're already mace class in vanilla and the only difference is that they have the pala auto mods, so nothing to be said here. Perhaps, since they're "holy" weapons, they could have slightly higher dam to undead and/ or demons

Staves: add defense or chance to block (parrying with a staff), blunt weapon so dam to undead. Low strength req, relatively high dex; damage increasing with dex rather than strength. Could grant a skill "insert good name here" like a stationary one revolution whirlwind, that knocks back enemies around you

Swords: edged weapon, so perhaps + dam to animals and demons, but -dam to undead, medium to high strength req, damage more dependent on dex, though. Perhaps small defence bonus/ chance to block since swords are rather good for parrying. Small chance of open wounds. Could also grant "stab" skill. Two handed or larger one handed ones could alternatively have "behead" skill that reduces monsters hitpoints to 0 with a relatively small chance, that could be increased dependent on how much life the monster has left (lower life left, better chance of succeeding). Would also reduce defence to 0 so that you could really only use it in one on one combat.

Wands: I'd leave them as magical weapons for granting skills (especially necro and sorc skills to other classes) that occasionally have high elemental damage on them, so that a magic using character could also deal some elemental damage should a monster come to close. Could grant either a "avaunt" skill, that repels enemies around you (like pala's sanctuary, but not only for undead) when cast (not an aura like pala's sanctuary), or teleport so you can magic the hell out of em from a safer place or "zap", which uses up all mana and deals an insane amount of damage to one monster.

Bows: Agreed. Damage should stay dex dependent. Perhaps higher damage but slower attack speed, since shooting fast with a bow is not so easy in reality. -dam to undead, +dam to animals, normal damage to demons. Could have a skill "snipe" that allows to take out single targets from a distance, but has -attack speed and/or large skill timer.

Crossbows: Should have a rather high strength req, but low dex. Way higher damage than bows, but SLOW. Same +- dam to undead, animals, demons as bows. Inbuilt pierce. Could also grant "snipe" or "shrapnel bolt", which would hit several monsters.

Spears: High damage to animals, demons, less to undead. Good melee range, perhaps knock back, damage strength dependent. Possibly "lowers target's defence" (what with making all these holes in it). Could grant "impale" which ignores target's defence, possibly slows it, too, an leaves open wounds

Javelins: I'd leave out the auto knock back. Damage dependent on dex; perhaps range could be affected by strength? Could grant "power throw" that adds piercing and some damage.

Throwing axes: nothing to add here, except that then this would be the only one I don't propose a skill for, so perhaps something similar to "snipe"

Throwing knives: Hm, sounds good. Perhaps grant "poisoned knife" for throwing or "stab" for melee.

Throwing potions: Finally someone tries to do something about them. For my mod, which is not even really in the planning stages, I thought about a new character class, the Alchemist, who would make use of them. Ideas: Blinding potion - explodes in a flash of light that blinds enemies nearby but does close to no damage or no damage at all; poison potions: already in the game, but perhaps there could be different sorts, like one that has no area damage but works like rabies. + some really mean toxins that make them a viable option in hell games. Acid potions - doing physical damage rather than poison and perhaps corrode the enemies' armour. Fire potions: Exploding ones, that do some area damage, combined fire and physical. Perhaps some cluster grenades that fire several smaller exploding potions in a random direction upon hitting. Greek fire: Fire-rabies. Hot-spot: Creating patches of burning ground where they land.
Those could be rare and/ or crafting items, the ingredients of which are also not so easy to find. Might need some crafting skills to produce them.

Hope some of that helps you.

[Desocupado]

Well instead of focusing on weapon types, let's try to focus on different situations that call for different weapon types:

Crushing Blow: A weapon type/family could have extremely high crushing blow (but dealing like 10% regular damage) while some enemies have obscene amounts of HP, requiring the usage of such weapons.

Knockback: This property is useful against targets that attack/move slowly with high damage and high attack rating.

Open wounds/Prevents target heal/Poison damage: This kind of property is good against targets with high resistances and/or regeneration. Bleed excels against low HP targets with high resistances.

Bow vs Xbow: One could have more range and the other much more damage